NLA Discussion: Advocates' talk

Thu Mar 18 11:41:21 EST 1999

David, Maricel, Andrea, & all ya'll,

I just read Dr Sticht's excellent report, Beyond 2000.  Fascinating data
and I agree with Dr. Stichts' assessment of the situation.   However,
about page 22 it becomes pretty alarming  when we begin talking of
future work force literacy requirements, then on page 29 we see the need
for future "demonstrable, sustainable, and useful gains" in adult
literacy programs,  on page 31 we see the adult literacy programs moving
from "marginal to mainstream" status. "Accountability" issues abound.

When we look at our current recruitment and retention rates and the
numbers of the target population and compare that to your best guess as
to what will be an acceptable set of numbers under a program of Federal
accountablility, we may begin wondering how we can achieve numbers
anything close to acceptable when, as Dr.  Sticht indicates (pg 22,
Hudson Institute Report) that 65-75% of the new jobs in the fastest
growing occupations will only require Language and math skills below the
8th grade level !   For without demand, there is no supply.  Nor can I
see Federal support growing to support a program that is unable to
produce sustainable gains under the current set of constraints as
Congress takes a critical look at the "literacy surplus" of the U.S. as
we enter the new century where our workers' literacy skills exceed that
needed in the work-place (pg 22).

I think this dilemma may tie directly into the issue of improvements
required in our individual programs to ensure that we are able to meet
the upcoming demands.  Interviewing and counseling of the adult student
to better fulfill their needs and to help them develop the internal
drive to overcome the personal negativities associated with literacy
processes becomes a very important issue.  Recently it was indicated to
me that there are no studies to indicate that adult literacy students
carry with them a specific set of emotional baggage attached to the
school-house environment OR that this set of emotions affects their
current cognitive abilities.  I disagree.

If we are unable to determine where our students came from and how they
got to us, how can we expect to serve their needs, or to identify what
the needs are?  This idea may indicate that we all need to be certified
counselors?  I believe this may be necessary in order that adult
literacy providers may delve into the personal lives of the adult
student safely and to be able to assist them in effectively overcoming
only those issues associated with education, and to be able to refer to
other agencies those problems needing advanced attention.  I would
rather see the available funding be earmarked for this rather than the
provision of "fluff" that in all possibility may not have a lasting
effect on the critical issues.

Art LaChance
Gilmer Learning Center
Ellijay, GA 30540
706-276-1110

Maricel Santos wrote:

> Based on my experience in a family literacy program, I
> also support an admissions interview with learners, but
> it's also important to note that some of the information we
> would like to have up front is very personal and would only
> be shared if the individual felt comfortable.  This kind of
> information is necessarily collected over a period of time
> and in relationships with other people. The hard questions
> should probably focus on school experiences at this initial
> stage. Also, it's important to remember that some of our
> learners have on-going contact with social services
> agencies who are "always in their business", as one of my
> students once told me.  We certainly don't want to take on
> the guise/role of a DSS agency.
>
> Maricel Santos
>
> On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 08:29:51 -0500 (EST) AWilder106 at aol.com
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Dear colleagues:
> >
> > This is in support of Art from Georgia.  I think an
> interview on admission > (not intake) which creates a
> literacy history is a good idea.  Questions on > the
> Literacy History part of an interview would include those
> we know are > associated with the adult student's
> performance, like educational level of > mother, drugs or
> drinking of the parents or children, any previous testing
> for > a learning disability, the student's perception of
> the reading/writing > difficulty, other programs the
> student has attended, the student's ethnic > group, what
> the student wants to learn in a literacy class, and why, >
> strategies the student has used to compensate for low
> literacy, why the > student has chosen this time to enter
> class, trauma, etc. >
> > Some of these could be "hard" questions, written down
> ahead of time;  others > could be "soft" questions the
> answers to which would arise in the normal > course of a
> conversation.  Each question I posed above is tied to a
> body of > research which says this is important to know,
> either immediately for the > student's teachers, or in
> order to generate and test a pattern that would > start to
> emerge over multiple admissions, perhaps as  "Literacy
> History > Milestones."
> > > I would also drop any language that suggested a medical
> model, hence the > change from Intake to Admissions.  Such
> a literacy teacher  would also probe > for cognitive states
> which influence brain structure, such as depression, >
> which can subtly alter the cortex.  Other non-genetic
> diseases do also, such > as fetal alcohol syndrome.
> > > There are probably  NLA writers out there now who know
> of other items of > importance to add.
> > > Andrea Wilder
> > >
> > >
>
> ----------------------------------------
> Maricel Santos Email: Maricel_Santos at gse.harvard.edu
> Address:  145 Pinckney St., #728, Boston, MA  02114
> Harvard University Graduate School of Education

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David, Maricel, Andrea, &amp; all ya'll,
I just read Dr Sticht's excellent report, Beyond 2000.&nbsp; Fascinating
data and I agree with Dr. Stichts' assessment of the situation.&nbsp;&nbsp;
However, about page 22 it becomes pretty alarming&nbsp; when we begin talking
of future work force literacy requirements, then on page 29 we see the
need for future "demonstrable, sustainable, and useful gains" in adult
literacy programs,&nbsp; on page 31 we see the adult literacy programs
moving from "marginal to mainstream" status. "Accountability" issues abound.
When we look at our current recruitment and retention rates and the
numbers of the target population and compare that to your best guess as
to what will be an acceptable set of numbers under a program of Federal
accountablility, we may begin wondering how we can achieve numbers anything
close to acceptable when, as Dr.&nbsp; Sticht indicates (pg 22, Hudson
Institute Report) that 65-75% of the new jobs in the fastest growing occupations
will only require Language and math skills below the 8th grade level
!&nbsp;&nbsp; For without demand, there is no supply.&nbsp; Nor
can I see Federal support growing to support a program that is unable to
produce sustainable gains under the current set of constraints as Congress
takes a critical look at the "literacy surplus" of the U.S. as we enter
the new century where our workers' literacy skills exceed that needed in
the work-place (pg 22).
I think this dilemma may tie directly into the issue of improvements
required in our individual programs to ensure that we are able to meet
the upcoming demands.&nbsp; Interviewing and counseling of the adult student
to better fulfill their needs and to help them develop the internal drive
to overcome the personal negativities associated with literacy processes
becomes a very important issue.&nbsp; Recently it was indicated to me that
there are no studies to indicate that adult literacy students carry with
them a specific set of emotional baggage attached to the school-house environment
OR that this set of emotions affects their current cognitive abilities.&nbsp;
I disagree.
If we are unable to determine where our students came from and how they
got to us, how can we expect to serve their needs, or to identify what
the needs are?&nbsp; This idea may indicate that we all need to be certified
counselors?&nbsp; I believe this may be necessary in order that adult literacy
providers may delve into the personal lives of the adult student safely
and to be able to assist them in effectively overcoming only those issues
associated with education, and to be able to refer to other agencies those
problems needing advanced attention.&nbsp; I would rather see the available
funding be earmarked for this rather than the provision of "fluff" that
in all possibility may not have a lasting effect on the critical issues.
 &nbsp;
Art LaChance
 Gilmer Learning Center
 Ellijay, GA 30540
 706-276-1110
Maricel Santos wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>Based on my experience in a family literacy program,
I
 also support an admissions interview with learners, but
 it's also important to note that some of the information we
 would like to have up front is very personal and would only
 be shared if the individual felt comfortable.&nbsp; This kind of
 information is necessarily collected over a period of time
 and in relationships with other people. The hard questions
 should probably focus on school experiences at this initial
 stage. Also, it's important to remember that some of our
 learners have on-going contact with social services
 agencies who are "always in their business", as one of my
 students once told me.&nbsp; We certainly don't want to take on
 the guise/role of a DSS agency.
Maricel Santos
On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 08:29:51 -0500 (EST) AWilder106 at aol.com
 wrote:
>
 > Dear colleagues:
 >
 > This is in support of Art from Georgia.&nbsp; I think an
 interview on admission > (not intake) which creates a
 literacy history is a good idea.&nbsp; Questions on > the
 Literacy History part of an interview would include those
 we know are > associated with the adult student's
 performance, like educational level of > mother, drugs or
 drinking of the parents or children, any previous testing
 for > a learning disability, the student's perception of
 the reading/writing > difficulty, other programs the
 student has attended, the student's ethnic > group, what
 the student wants to learn in a literacy class, and why, >
 strategies the student has used to compensate for low
 literacy, why the > student has chosen this time to enter
 class, trauma, etc. >
 > Some of these could be "hard" questions, written down
 ahead of time;&nbsp; others > could be "soft" questions the
 answers to which would arise in the normal > course of a
 conversation.&nbsp; Each question I posed above is tied to a
 body of > research which says this is important to know,
 either immediately for the > student's teachers, or in
 order to generate and test a pattern that would > start to
 emerge over multiple admissions, perhaps as&nbsp; "Literacy
 History > Milestones."
 > > I would also drop any language that suggested a medical
 model, hence the > change from Intake to Admissions.&nbsp; Such
 a literacy teacher&nbsp; would also probe > for cognitive states
 which influence brain structure, such as depression, >
 which can subtly alter the cortex.&nbsp; Other non-genetic
 diseases do also, such > as fetal alcohol syndrome.
 > > There are probably&nbsp; NLA writers out there now who know
 of other items of > importance to add.
 > > Andrea Wilder
 > >
 > >
----------------------------------------
 Maricel Santos Email: Maricel_Santos at gse.harvard.edu
 Address:&nbsp; 145 Pinckney St., #728, Boston, MA&nbsp; 02114
 Harvard University Graduate School of Education</blockquote>
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