[AAACE-NLA] Delusion of Accountability in Adult Education (longer)

[AndresMuro at aol.com]

In a message dated 5/26/2004 1:36:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AWilder106 writes:

> 
> Andres,
> 
> (I will try to wind my way through your rhetoric.)
> 
> Ok, you say that there are some assessments that can be used, what are they?  

Teacher's observations, annecdotes, writing samples, retention, completion of courses, students coming back, GED test results, number of students who transition into something else. 

> 
> What do your teachers use to assess their students at the end of a literacy course?  Types of assessments?

Forms where they write their opinions, roster with numbers of students that complete a course, GED passing scores, number of students who enroll in college courses, students that go to employment or something else, writing samples, student evaluations of instruction, annecdotes such as "I was able to speak to the doctor", number of students that took a glucose level test, number of students who requested an HIV test or another health services, BEST scores for EL Civics only. 

In fact, I just sent you a list of annecdotes from our program. I believe that they provide a really good way to get a sense of who is comming to a program, what they face and what they learn.  
> 
> I think, but am not sure, you get money from your local community for your programs;  are you part of a larger institution?    Grants?  State monies?  Do you get  money from the AELS?

Right now we have funding from the college (El Paso Community College, where I work) that covers some 5 full time institutional positions. The rest comes from: DOE-Migrant High School Equivalency Program, Pfizer-Health Literacy, Texas Education Agency-EL Civics,  Department of Corrections/El Paso Families-ESL and GED classes, local public schools-ESL and GED classes. We are always looking for more, do you have any?

> 
> I would trust you as a teacher if I knew something about your work, your background,  your students.  The problem is you don't teach students in 50 states, so your background, teaching ability, are not applicable to all cases.  I am interested in (perhaps multiple)  
> ways of gathering data that are comparable across cases, that are  valid and reliable.  
> 
> You are part of an accredited institution (I think) and that may be part of a solution.  There may be multiple answers to the problem.

Actually, while we are part of an accredited institution, our reporting is to agencies outside of the college. Since most funding comes from grants, when we apply, we develop the assessment plan. Some funders have specific requirements. For example, DOE HEP requires a GED certificate. While this is a standardized form of assessment, we considered it a good one because the piece of paper is an entitlement to access other things. So, it represents a level of cultural capital. 

We also have funding from TEA and we are required to assess students with the BEST test. However, BEST test scores are meaningless to the students and in helping us assess the students in any way. However, they are the only acceptable thing that allow us to get more funding. We are more interested in knowing how the students use English, how happy they are with the class, how much they learn about meaningful things to them, where they go after they complete a class, do they come back for more? 

Because we need to test them extensively through the BEST and we need to input the data into a system, part of the funding  goes into that instead of going directly into student services. The sad part is the BEST test scores do not predict or assess the potentiality of students to succeed in the workforce or to participate in civics life. Of course, You, me, Larry Condelli, the entire staff at AIR and everyone else knows this. 

You say that you know my background and this is why you trust me. However, you know me much better than most teachers know their doctors, their pilots, the taxi drivers, their own or their children's teachers, etc. And yet, we put our hands on them assuming that they have some knowledge about what they are doing and that their expertise counts for something. So, when you kid gets an A on an assignment or someone gets an A on a research paper, we assume that the person mastered their skills w/o knowing much about the person's background. Again, we assume that the person has the expertise to provide this service and assess your child. 

So, if a college and a public school can hire teachers and let them decide if a student is ready to pass or fail, why can't we  be allowed to do the same. 

Andres 


> 
> Andrea
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
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